NC: Who here is interested in a NC RHD Turbo Kit???

Postby **NitroDann** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:29 pm

Yes but the question is how will you run the car?

Full standalone?

Dann

bruce · Postby **bruce** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 3:07 pm

Can't be engineered thus not legal (in Vic at least), so why would there be much interest?

Charlie Brown · Postby **Charlie Brown** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 3:29 pm

NitroDann wrote:Yes but the question is how will you run the car?

Full standalone?

Dann

NC's in the States just get their OEM ECU flashed. Piggy backs or seperate stand alone systems have too many problems.

The guys in the States running a turbo or supercharger system, generally have updated the crank to the NC2 spec. or use the Focus Turbo crank and rods.
Look here: http://thebluemeany.blogspot.com.au/

Postby **NitroDann** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 3:37 pm

I think people seriously need to do more research on how the car with reflashed FI systems are running and how they drive.

Dont make me spell it out, just do more research.

You need to run an Xede or something for this to actually safely work.

Dann

Sailor · Postby **Sailor** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 3:44 pm

Dann, I'd suggest you do some research to see just how well NCs with flashed ECUs are running both NA and FI.
Many started with Xede and other piggyback and pretty quickly moved to reflashes for better power, economy and reliability.

I have an Xede for sale if you want...

Postby **NitroDann** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 4:05 pm

If everyone in Australia is so happy with theirs why is no one bragging about how their car is going fantastic and meets all the registration requirements to make it legal?

Why is that people are contacting me to help them find a solution that works after doing their own research?

This is the best link of all to post - http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=472692
Covers all sorts of stuff and shows just how much so many people dont know about what is really going on with the Forced induction cars.
In NSW, all aftermarket FI cars have to pass IM240s and it is required for each car.
The stock ecu has things like adaptive fuel trims, so when your fuel filter starts getting blocked it can add a percent or 2 fuel to the whole map to make up for that, maybe 10% total.
It also has things like a base timing trim to account for things like stretched timing chains etc which can be altered by flashing just like the 14* advance mod on an na6.

You can even reduce hysteresis on the fly by wire system giving better throttle response.

This all works 100% great on a car with intake and exhaust allowing 10% better breathing, as the ecu has a means to add 10% trim, but doesnt have a fuel table like an aftermarket ecu that have 16x16 map with each cell programmable.
No matter how far you whack the fuel trims up, and how far the knock sensor pulls timing in limp mode to save the engine, the stock ecu doesnt have the resolution to make 50% or even 25% more power than stock.

Yes the SC cars make more power than stock (until they ping the ring lands off, or melt the pistons) but we shouldnt be surprised that a good tune on a stock engine make less power than a limp mode with 10psi crammed in it.

Based on what Im been told by some NC owners, victoria requires a FULL ADR test for this type of modification and they cost upwards of $30k to do.

So thats like a full compliance job for each car rather than an engineering job.
Basically it cannot be done in Victoria, and in NSW requires a xede and an IM240 at the least until someone comes up with a setup, has the setup compliance plated like the avo kit was for na6, and then you still need that 200 odd dollar IM240 test.

Dann

NC_Hammer · Postby **NC_Hammer** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 10:11 pm

- Cars seem to be running very well with Jay's TDR tunes.
- I'm not fussed about ADR as it won't be a daily once done.
- ADR emission testing does not cost upwards of $30k here in Vic. More like $1.5-2k for the emission test + engineer fees usually upwards of $800.
- There are many other makes that reflash stock ECU's and work flawlessly with FI, just take a chapter out of the Honda guys and Hondata, it's possible. Begi's piggback is very old now, it was a band aid solution as all piggy backs are, there has been a lot of development since and looks like there continually will be.

- BTW how many FI NC's are there in Aus atm? what about 2? I find it hard to believe there are (you seem to imply quite a few) of people coming to you for a solution when there are only a handful (If that) of FI NC's here????

Postby **NitroDann** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 11:14 pm

5 that I know of.

People asking me do not yet have FI.

People with FI and these issues are contacting serious legit shops who may be able to help solve the issues.

Yes aussie cars seem to be running ok just like the TDR ones but the truth here proves to be dissimilar to whats read in the forums I dont know if america is different, I certaintly have no proof of the usa cars running well, and those in the know seem to believe its very unlikely.

Dann

jerrah · Postby **jerrah** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 11:32 am

On the UK forum mx5nutz there are disastrous stories about the reflash with NC's running the Cosworth supercharger kit. Anecdotally some owners have reverted to running N/A after requiring engine repairs.

I feel a degree of confidence with a tuned stand alone rather than a stock ECU with the gain turned up. My understanding is that the Hondata and Evo flashes DO have tunable cells in their tables. If the Mazda 'flash' works like this and is individually tuned to each car I see no issue with it.

Postby **NitroDann** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 2:10 pm

The GM, Evo, and hondata do have unlocked tunable tables, so does nistune, som eof these however require a daughterboard to be soldered in for this.

The reflashes we use do not.

Dann

NC_Hammer · Postby **NC_Hammer** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:13 pm

*shruggs!*

anyway, some updates from the miata.net forum by TDR....

Big news for down under and the far east ..

Due to the intense interest.

TDR in partnership with one of Australias premier Racing companies will begin development of the Right hand drive TDR2 Turbo Kit for Australia and Japan

This Kit will be made in TDR's fashion- Top Top quality. and of course will be smog legal and tuned to perfection.

We may have a waiting list for this kit so get your name early...

Jay

Wonder who it is.

http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=472354&page=5

Postby **NitroDann** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:27 pm

I do believe it may be possible to do this, and I hope so, however this is not the first time people have claimed to be able to do this and cannot.

Dann